[20:55:28] 57 secs [20:55:40] =] [20:56:45] okey [20:56:50] i guess we will have to wait [20:57:05] since 3 devs; 2 hts and 2 exherbos are not exactly desired combo [20:57:18] I'm here [20:57:19] lol [20:58:00] --> bonsaikitten (i=quassel@gentoo/developer/bonsaikitten) has joined #gentoo-meetings [20:58:02] --> dagger (n=quassel@gentoo/developer/dagger) has joined #gentoo-meetings [20:58:12] that helped... a bit :) [20:58:23] --> yngwin (n=yngwin@gentoo/developer/yngwin) has joined #gentoo-meetings [20:58:25] --> Ingmar (i=ingmar@exherbo/developer/ingmar) has joined #gentoo-meetings [20:58:33] --> ayoy (n=ayoy@cs78245237.pp.htv.fi) has joined #gentoo-meetings [20:58:43] here [20:59:10] ok [20:59:14] looks better :] [20:59:19] so for the tampakrap [20:59:21] http://www.pastebin.cz/b594e8e991906a [20:59:30] i count him as excuses due to personal matters [20:59:41] --> Gentoochild (n=bla@vpn5.rz.tu-ilmenau.de) has joined #gentoo-meetings [20:59:43] please read the above paste [20:59:50] pesa has no internet currently [21:00:35] and ayoy is being grilled by his recruiter [21:01:03] ok [21:01:16] anyone said that he will be late? [21:01:32] otherwise i just wrote up our roll-call, i count everyone whom joined as here [21:01:34] not that i know [21:01:42] ok [21:02:08] ok so i would say lets start with topic 1 [21:02:12] i'm having a headache, so i'd like to keep this short on my end [21:02:37] for that i count as relevant tampakraps opinion, and reavertm's they are the last one working on it [21:02:51] so since tampakrap said it in mail i would ask reavertm if he has something to add [21:02:52] scarabeus: I'll talk to tampakrap, but 2 things about the KDE3 overlay [21:03:07] scarabeus: 1. Let's call it kde-junk, kde-sunset, or something like that. [21:03:27] jmbsvicetto: no problem i have all powers about gitosis [21:03:36] scarabeus: 2. We can't drop any ebuilds from the tree before at least the end of the year [21:03:37] just sent me after decided name [21:03:51] with 2 i agree [21:03:56] The reason is that we shouldn't tie an overlay to a specific kde version [21:03:57] i would start it after 4.4 [21:04:01] if nothing evil happen [21:04:17] At least not before we get 2 KDE4 minor versions marked stable [21:04:22] I is here, mostly :) [21:04:38] So if we got 4.2 and 4.3 marked stable, then we could consider dropping 3.5 from the tree [21:04:38] we'll probably need an announcement and a news item and any other possible means of communication to alert current kde3 users that they have to add the overlay if they want kde3 [21:04:59] a few months before we remove it [21:05:04] that is simple news item [21:05:13] ad it can go hand in hand with mask :] [21:05:23] i think 3 month mask for this is good idea :] [21:05:26] I think we should make such news after first kde4 goes stable [21:05:32] its simple but it can also be devastating if we forget :p [21:05:44] and before i forget "DID ANYONE FIND SOME CONTRIBUTORS?" [21:06:10] I suppose we'll find some gentoo devs still with 3.5 [21:06:13] iirc sping showed some interest before the summer [21:06:37] he's resuming recruitment process now [21:07:00] will you talk to him and find out? [21:07:07] *mind [21:07:08] i can yes [21:07:28] I don't know if my opinion counts, but I really agree to dagger, you should announce that even befor kde4 is marked as stable. It may be very painful for some users to make the change. [21:07:49] he has point ^ [21:08:16] scarabeus: kde3 packages moved to overlay won't be subject of package.mask, will they? [21:08:17] some people dont like kde4 and we wont change it. We just need to make sure they've got enough time to get use to overlay [21:08:28] (they shouldn't imho) [21:08:29] we just need to make sure that people will have the overlay added before we remove the ebuilds [21:08:32] reavertm: wont [21:08:39] and i agree we reavertm we shouldnt mask it [21:08:40] I would suggest announcing loudly and often, in many venues so that (hopefully) very few users are taken by suprise [21:08:41] (just have keywords dropped probably) [21:08:44] and it needs to be stable before it is marked stable [21:08:46] scarabeus: news item, planet blog entries, forums thread, front page announcement, ... ;) [21:09:04] jmbsvicetto: sounds good [21:09:40] jmbsvicetto: can you do it, please please our PR farry [21:10:22] i'd wait with too widespread announcements until there is a stable candidate [21:10:45] indeed [21:11:00] well i was not saying NOW i mean when the time will come [21:11:04] (which movesus towards second topic) [21:11:04] that moves us to point no 2 [21:11:25] wait a bit, i have one problem with kde3 [21:11:44] i have seen that debian ship more patches marked as security for kde3 than we even have as bugs [21:11:55] --> ahf (i=ahf@irssi/staff/ahf) has joined #gentoo-meetings [21:12:14] we need people now to start maintaining kde3 [21:12:49] or mask it right after we stable first kde4, dont say remove just mask for sec-issues [21:13:17] kde3 is dead end. I think we need to decide how long are we going to maintain it [21:13:26] users wont be happy, but i have to agree [21:14:04] I'd suggest faster gentoo stable releases so that we can keep up with stable version being the one actually yet supported by upstream [21:14:08] i think we can write some news item onto the homepage/spread as news [21:14:20] and if noone will volunteer to work on it in 7 days... [21:14:22] for example 4.2 branch is no longer mainataned... [21:14:26] scarabeus: ok [21:14:30] scarabeus: About the news [21:14:48] i agree, we need to recruit kde3 maintainers immediately [21:14:49] --> tampakrap (n=tuxicity@gentoo/developer/tampakrap) has joined #gentoo-meetings [21:15:04] tampakrap: you, here, how, why [21:15:11] go home! [21:15:14] just for logs bye [21:15:14] reavertm: What do you mean about the package.mask? Do you mean masking KDE3 ebuilds now or after they're moved to the overlay? [21:15:16] ^^ [21:15:58] jmbsvicetto: he was worried if we would keep the mask in tree after we move it to the overlay, which is NO [21:16:13] what scarab said [21:16:19] if we mask it, we might as well move it [21:16:40] scarabeus / reavertm: I see and I agree with you - no [21:16:55] no, users sometimes hate overlays, unmasking is simple [21:17:00] or we actualy can let them decide [21:17:10] But we shouldn't mask it until some time after we get KDE-4 marked stable [21:17:14] i would start with the anouncing call for maintainers on homepage and on all pcs [21:17:27] then we will know if someone cares [21:17:32] we can recruit the peeps [21:17:35] we have the powah [21:17:37] :] [21:17:37] I'm sorry, but half my brain is being pulled to #gentoo-userrel [21:17:55] jmbsvicetto: yes that we mentioned too, after at least 1 kde4 stabled [21:18:48] but if there are security issues that nobody is fixing, we may need to mask earlier [21:19:04] jmbsvicetto: anouncement on homepage and as newsitem if noone reply in timely manner (week) then after [21:19:04] kde4 is stabilised we will right away mask it as security threat. then it will live until [21:19:04] kde4.4 but masked/or in overlay (to be decided). [21:19:16] this is my braindead summary [21:19:51] agreed [21:19:55] I would say make kde4.a stable, than make kde4.b stable and mask kde3 [21:20:23] unless critical bugs will force us to make it earlier [21:20:30] dagger: there must be security ones [21:20:32] mask* [21:20:49] just browse debian patches [21:20:51] another thing to consider when ditching KDE3 is whether all kde3 apps are available for kde4 (like k3b) [21:21:06] k3b for kde4 works perfectly [21:21:10] Gentoochild: security has privilege [21:21:13] (was jsut an exampolke) [21:21:14] dagger: not really [21:21:14] mythtv seems to be a problem [21:21:30] I wonder whether leaving kdelibs:3.5 + some apps would be a problem [21:21:32] reavertm: I'm using it 2-3 times a week for cd dvd5/9 - all fine [21:21:43] reavertm thats what i was thinking as well [21:22:00] maybe we can leave kdelibs3 and a few apps around for a little longer (like +6 months) [21:22:10] yngwin: I wouldn't mask it, but after we get one KDE4 version marked stable, we should start warning users *publicly* to the status of KDE3 security [21:22:13] dagger: try writing udf image wth verify - it will lock on 50% on disk eject, but that's off topic [21:22:29] jmbsvicetto: what are those security issue? khtml? [21:22:37] yngwin: If that upsets upstream, I don't care. Maybe it might lead someone to start fixing issues [21:22:41] reavertm: khtml as starters [21:22:42] jmbsvicetto: no it's very simple: if there are security issues they need to be fixed or the affected packages masked [21:22:47] there was some more in kdelibs and parts [21:22:56] simple tracking debian can work [21:22:57] maybe it's easier just to dump kde desktop (along with affected apps) and leave kdelibs + some apps that are known to work [21:22:59] but we need that maintainer [21:23:23] I use Kile very often, and the kde4 version of if is far far away to be usable... [21:23:35] --> ABCD_ (n=ABCD@gentoo/contributor/abcd) has joined #gentoo-meetings [21:23:53] yngwin: As a Gentoo policy, you're right. But in that case we should probably have masked KDE-3 a few months ago [21:24:03] yes [21:24:11] jmbsvicetto: yes but now we will have stable replacement [21:24:14] so let's try to make things right asap [21:24:29] <-- ABCD (n=ABCD@gentoo/contributor/abcd) has quit (Nick collision from services.) [21:24:32] i would say wait with this decision we can wait for the anouncement and proceed if noone appears [21:24:33] could someone PM me the logs from " this is my braindead summary" through my re-joining? [21:24:48] <-> ABCD_ is now known as ABCD [21:24:50] I suppose masking the only stable kde release is not an option so please make sure we have one left :P [21:25:08] sure hold on [21:25:45] reavertm: if no maintainers step up, that is currently our only option [21:26:38] yngwin: ok [21:26:48] then we should do as scarabeus said [21:27:07] can we make a poll on forums, to see how many users still use kde3 and how many moved to kde4? [21:27:33] yngwin: but we should all be aware that even when kde-4 gets marked stable, it's very unlikely that any arch besides x86, amd64, ppc and ppc64 will get it marked stable soon [21:27:34] yes we can [21:27:35] dagger: well usage is not our issue, we need maintainers [21:27:37] of course it will represent only small percentage of users, but should give us some guidelines [21:27:51] hey there [21:27:54] jmbsvicetto: i bet on hppa [21:28:01] jmbsvicetto: sure, i dont think it will be marked stable soon on any arch [21:28:09] yngwin: so masking kde-3 will upset quite a few users from these arches, but it will also upset people in the other arches [21:28:35] scarabeus: Don't forget ia64 or sparc [21:28:42] so the key is to get some ppl to step up and maintain&fix [21:28:55] yes [21:29:01] so exactly what i said [21:29:05] scarabeus: sparc is still tied to qt-webkit dying with alignment issues [21:29:20] so no cookies for sparc [21:29:32] jmbsvicetto: i agree it is bad solution, but it is worse to leave it rot around [21:29:40] at least 1 maintainer [21:29:48] it is not so hard, the ebuilds are mostly cleaned and fixed [21:29:56] they just need the patches and testing [21:29:57] scarabeus: And unfortunately, it seems each day KDE upstream is more concerned with Windows,OS/X than with Linux alternative arches [21:30:15] i expected that one [21:30:34] scarabeus: I'm not arguing against your proposal. I'm just making a few "warning" ;) [21:30:46] so you can show the logs when they blame you :P [21:30:48] :DDDDD [21:30:58] they can still unmask or use overlay if they want kde3 [21:31:02] i would say lets go for next subject [21:31:22] agreed [21:32:06] i summarised it really nicely and jorge as boss can tweak it more to reflect us so we all write our proposals for it [21:32:15] jmbsvicetto: one Q, did you see carlo lately? [21:32:31] jmbsvicetto: he did kde3 commits when he was around, so that is why i ask :] [21:33:18] the awkard silence... [21:33:36] okey so for the 4.2 stabling i would say vote? [21:34:04] i vote hell no [21:34:05] i say we go for 4.3 [21:34:10] hell no [21:34:13] so no =] [21:34:21] 4.3 is the way to go [21:34:25] I vote.. wait for 4.3.1 [21:34:34] -*- yngwin is with reavertm [21:34:45] there's one 'problem' [21:34:51] yeah, 4.3.1 sounds like the best candidate [21:34:53] you know my opinion but for the record 4.3 [21:35:00] kde 4.3 will need phonon-4.4pre [21:35:08] the snapshot is stable [21:35:11] where is the issue [21:35:20] what snapshot [21:35:21] which is good as it works very well, just doen't look official (and it's not, it's our snapshot) [21:35:26] phonon [21:35:39] reavertm: i would say it is ook [21:35:46] it works peachy for everyone around here [21:35:49] second thing - akonadi-server sqlite USE flag could be masked in profile [21:35:59] reavertm: why? it is so borked? [21:36:04] i didnt get time to test it yet [21:36:13] scarabeus: ok [21:36:13] scarabeus: carlo? no [21:36:13] no prblems with phonon [21:36:42] scarabeus: I'll have to double check, but I think he's got under undertakers view [21:36:42] no idea, works for me, but upstream says sqlite threads support is broken sometimes and may cause data loss when using sqlite backend [21:36:47] scarabeus: meaning is subject to retirement for inactivity [21:36:54] jmbsvicetto: understood [21:37:00] and I think would just need better testinb whether it's really the case [21:37:04] About KDE4, 4.2.4 [21:37:08] data loss = mask it [21:37:15] If we wait for 4.3, time will fly by us [21:37:35] 4.2.4 is not stable, boss [21:37:35] (mysql is enabled by default for now and sqlite is marked as experimental in pkg_postinst anyway) [21:37:40] 4.3.0 has some nasty bugs that upstream has admitted already and 4.3.1 shouldn't be out before 1st or 2nd week of September [21:37:42] neither is 4.3.0 [21:37:48] jmbsvicetto: yes and no. 4.2 is no longer maintained, and 4.3.1 will give us some time to fix some bugs in 4.3 [21:37:58] Add at least 1 month to that for asking for it to be marked stable and we'll be getting very close to the year's end [21:38:38] yep, but i think we need 1 month to fix all the issues we have in the tracker anyway [21:38:39] yngwin: I think 4.2.4 is not a perfect release, but it's getting very close and will allow us to have a stable version almost 2 months before 4.3 [21:38:52] I believe having 4.3.1 stable by the time 4.3.3 is released sounds good [21:38:55] of course before anyone thinks of any kde4 stabilization, blocker bugs needs to be fixed first [21:38:59] 4.2.4 is usable, but certainly not stable [21:39:13] 4.2.4 is my vote - but majority rules ;) [21:39:23] yeah we rule and you rock :] [21:39:28] (you know the joke right?) [21:39:35] -*- reavertm knows [21:39:35] 4.3.0 is more stable than 4.2.4 ;) [21:39:45] -*- scarabeus confirm [21:39:50] If i can vote, I vote on 4.3.1, 4.3.0 crashes sometimes... [21:40:03] much more than 4.2.4 in fact [21:40:09] actually stability wise i have never had plasma crash yet on 4.3.9999 (and there were some on 4.2 for me) [21:40:16] i never had a crash on 4.3.0, but saw some bugs about it [21:40:36] i'm having plasma issues with both 4.2.4 and 4.3.0 [21:41:05] my vote is to go with 4.3.1 (or 4.3.0 with some patches added) and if so - remove 4.2.4 from tree [21:41:18] well, not on 4.2 anymore as i upgraded both boxes now [21:41:24] the only plasmoid which crashes plasma for me is microblogging = 100% crash rate [21:41:30] reavertm: I don't mean a plasma crash, but dolphin crashes, konqueror crashes sometimes, and plasma crashes :D but it isn't often and it "recover" itself all the times here [21:41:56] I doubt anyone still uses 4.2 - adding 4.3 umasked was epic kill for idea of stabilizing 4.2 [21:42:01] on 4.2.4 i had plasma crashes completely freeze up X [21:42:23] i am for that removal [21:42:26] 4.2 [21:42:27] so, do we need to count the votes than? [21:42:36] dagger: no need, only boss was for 4.2 [21:42:36] or is it decided [21:42:40] yngwin: i can be video drivers issue, I have never had a X freeze up with kde 4.2.* [21:42:49] nvidia [21:42:53] yngwin: ati [21:42:59] nvidia, worksformetm [21:43:08] what reavertm said [21:43:10] btwwho is working on stable bugs? [21:43:20] i saw only reaver commenting on them and i closed few [21:43:24] but the list is still large [21:43:29] intel 4500hd and nvidia here. Nvidia doesn't like new kernel and heci (from staging) driver [21:43:34] i need to ask you to pick 1-2 from there and fix them [21:43:39] some of them are gfx driver issues [21:43:54] yeah, we need them fixed asap [21:44:16] ok, can we move on? [21:44:33] i want to hear that they read what i wrote ^ [21:44:39] :D [21:44:57] summary of no. 2 please :) [21:45:32] http://www.pastebin.cz/22046 [21:45:34] here you are [21:45:50] --> Coopy (n=Coop@p4FEDA352.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #gentoo-meetings [21:46:01] looks good [21:46:28] yngwin: next topic is yours [21:47:07] ok, we're ready to add qt4-tng.eclass to portage, no alternative names have been proposed [21:47:39] i plan to do a review this weekend and send it to -dev ml for rfc [21:48:06] qt4-superstar could go? [21:48:09] qt4-meh [21:48:11] :] [21:48:12] lol [21:48:15] qt4-blah ? [21:48:17] qt4-v2 ? [21:48:23] qt5 [21:48:25] :D [21:48:26] qt4-thisistheoneyouwant [21:48:27] im a bit worried about tng, it sounds good and all [21:48:31] ayoy: LOL [21:48:39] <-- |Francis| (n=kvirc@AGrenoble-152-1-28-162.w82-122.abo.wanadoo.fr) has quit (Remote closed the connection) [21:48:48] but what if we want to replace it again in the distant future [21:48:59] what is tng? [21:49:01] qt4-tng sounds a lil bit like star trek, but I think we can live with it ;p [21:49:04] well, you can send bikeshedding proposals once the rfc is on ml [21:49:04] well you can live with one damn eclass like us [21:49:08] it doesnt sound like it [21:49:10] Ronis_BR: the next generation [21:49:11] it is startrek [21:49:12] :p [21:49:16] O_o [21:49:30] wierd :) [21:49:39] to baldly go where no-one has gone before [21:49:44] --> |Francis| (n=kvirc@AGrenoble-152-1-28-162.w82-122.abo.wanadoo.fr) has joined #gentoo-meetings [21:49:48] -*- wired wonders if after tng we'll have the-empire-strikes-back or something [21:49:51] :P [21:49:55] to baldly compile what noone else was able to do [21:50:03] wired: lol [21:50:08] wired: good name for kde3 overlay maybe? [21:50:13] :D [21:50:16] lol [21:50:21] yngwin: i am open for proposals [21:50:27] and i have strong feelings for this one [21:50:31] :} [21:50:32] eheheh [21:50:38] but isn't qt4-tng or whatever meant to replace the old qt4.eclass? [21:50:47] eventually yes [21:51:00] qties4.eclass [21:51:01] :D [21:51:07] we can't just dump the old one and put the new one in place [21:51:11] no [21:51:12] you cant [21:51:13] dagger: sure [21:51:17] you would break the ebulds [21:51:22] *current [21:51:22] yep [21:51:24] yes we need a migration [21:51:30] you guys should really "learn" how to make drastic eclass changes in place like we do :D (with no new eclasses involved) [21:51:33] qt4-tng is a gentoo version with patches or not? [21:51:36] unless you want to check all ebuilds that use qt4.eclass wrt new functionality [21:51:39] reavertm: see this is reason why i slapped you everytime for backcompat [21:51:50] scarabeus: with kde-misc? :P [21:51:58] its TNG folks [21:52:05] does picard look like kirk to you? [21:52:07] :D [21:52:10] reavertm: yep :] [21:52:20] kirk had better chicks [21:52:22] they had skirts [21:52:23] ok, back to the point please [21:52:24] <-- Coopy (n=Coop@p4FEDA352.dip.t-dialin.net) has quit ("Leaving") [21:52:29] ok ok [21:52:33] i think tng is done [21:52:49] as far as i'm concerned yes [21:53:02] or just qt4-0.1.eclass [21:53:10] (then 0.2 for next revision :P) [21:53:13] "Backcompat is to still commit in the present the errors commited in the past" [21:53:15] jmbsvicetto: you should push your versioned eclasses idea [21:53:28] ok anyway [21:53:36] the last thing is bit brainstorming [21:53:42] what shoudl we focus on in future [21:53:45] too bad you can't do it in place [21:54:32] I remember seeing an agenda item in some email about the unversioned sets [21:54:35] sorry guys - mind at userrel [21:55:11] ABCD: i was waiting on jorge to come back so i left it as totaly last [21:55:19] scarabeus: ok [21:55:21] scarabeus: That idea wasn't mine, I just pulled it out of the dust ark ;) [21:55:38] :] [21:55:46] ok any ideas/proposals what we should focus [21:55:51] we will have new recruits [21:55:51] scarabeus: The versioned eclasses [21:55:58] jmbsvicetto: i understood [21:56:07] and for them we need something creative to do [21:56:12] we cant just leave them fix bugs [21:56:14] same for us [21:56:22] if i would only fix bugs i would went insane [21:57:10] in qt team we are actively looking at adding new qt4-based packages all the time [21:57:13] i had idea about branding, but then i cant draw [21:57:22] :) [21:57:33] so someone else would have to mentor the idea [21:57:34] documentation could use more work too [21:57:49] I had an idea of qt-based portage gui [21:57:56] but then I wouldn't use it [21:58:00] :D [21:58:06] ayoy: noone would I think :p [21:58:09] :) [21:58:10] scarabeus: There's always the "fix upstream build system" idea ;) [21:58:21] there was a kde(3?) one iirc [21:58:21] scarabeus: branding is actually a lovely idea, remember that gentoo kstart icon quantumsummers had? [21:58:24] we need artists [21:58:25] I have some task, not sure whether suitable for newcomers [21:58:40] i have tasks not suitable for myself :D [21:58:44] so go on [21:58:45] :] [21:58:47] I need eclass for odbc driver management [21:59:01] supporting iODBC and unixODBC interfaces [21:59:35] well that is totaly not beginner work [21:59:37] ok, next [21:59:40] I'm sorry guys, but I will have to leave you now. I need to pick up my wife. [21:59:48] registering/unregistring drivers, in similar way like in debian, (but separately - one for iODBC and one for unixODBC) [21:59:56] c ya dagger [22:00:21] (it should be easy, mostrly it's just invocation of unixodbc tool with creating some files in /etc) [22:00:33] well if you find interested recruit go for it [22:00:36] --> Francois (n=francois@193.253.141.72) has joined #gentoo-meetings [22:00:50] reavertm: question. how is your reviewing going by? [22:01:08] I'm lazy to send fixed quizzes [22:01:25] gosh [22:01:31] please do so [22:01:34] sooon [22:01:35] :] [22:01:35] nevermind [22:01:47] ok last topic is SETS [22:01:53] I hate the current state [22:01:56] i preffer metas more [22:02:12] so we need someone to write proper specs for what we need from sets [22:02:12] <-- |Francis| (n=kvirc@AGrenoble-152-1-28-162.w82-122.abo.wanadoo.fr) has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) [22:02:21] and talk about it with zac [22:02:27] and even better help him implementing [22:02:34] jmbsvicetto: ^ ? [22:02:38] oh yes, have anyone read bug 272488 ? [22:02:40] am i right? [22:02:53] https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=272488 [22:03:04] i did i liked [22:03:08] reavertm: That sounds like an eselect and not eclass (odbc) [22:03:09] you volunteer? [22:03:29] scarabeus: I'll take this one [22:03:47] scarabeus: I've been meaning to write about it for a *long* time, but I keep postponning it [22:03:48] jmbsvicetto: use teh bug as base, i like the idea [22:03:57] scarabeus: Can I ask you to poke me about it until I do? ;) [22:04:54] jmbsvicetto: hmm, not really, it would be eclass for packages that provide odbc driver [22:04:55] reavertm: I know the bug. My plan is to get back to the basics about sets [22:05:07] it's not about switching between iodbc vs unixodbc [22:05:07] if you promise you wont mark me as your counter person for next lead vote ;] [22:05:09] :D [22:05:11] ok can do [22:05:13] (it's determined at compilation time) [22:05:18] I wonder when gentoo guys will look at https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=268891 [22:05:18] reavertm: ok, then I misunderstood. sorry [22:05:46] scarabeus: Are you affraid instead I'll point to you when it gets time for the next election? ;) [22:06:04] :D [22:06:20] okey [22:06:28] anything else for the sets, we will leave them to you [22:06:32] and poke you about it :] [22:06:42] jmbsvicetto: I think 2.2 style sets are dead end [22:07:02] confusing syntax [22:07:39] what i want is kde-latest-release sets [22:07:58] that is quite hard to make but i see the point :] [22:08:00] so that 4.2.4 would be automatically updated to 4.3.0 [22:08:19] yngwin: that's basically unversioned sets ;) [22:08:21] also i think we should stop encouraging set usage in docs [22:08:24] yes [22:08:33] the unversioned sets work like that :) [22:08:39] they dont [22:08:44] too much package fuzz movement [22:08:52] / [22:09:07] scarabeus: they do - the problem is our "non-stopping" upstream ;) [22:09:42] ok, anything else for the meeting? [22:10:01] scarabeus: They have what we call here "bicho de carpinteiro". They can sit still for a minute and thus keep moving packages left and right, adding new ones, killing old ones and finding new and better ways to make distros life harder ;) [22:10:11] do you guys think we should move the plasmoids from kde-testing to the tree? [22:10:13] The can't sit still* [22:10:24] wired: we can [22:10:30] wired: How good do you think they are? [22:10:32] just test them for leaks [22:10:36] and crashes [22:10:38] everytime [22:10:40] plasma is core [22:10:44] if it crashes it is PITA [22:10:48] jmbsvicetto: some of them are pretty good, others i have no idea [22:10:59] wired: then add the one you like [22:11:00] i mostly test that they build and occasionally that they load [22:11:09] wired: I don't see a problem with adding good ones [22:11:21] but you really have to test them [22:11:24] and what scarabeus said ;) [22:11:31] ok so on a per-plasmoid basis [22:11:36] kk [22:11:55] well, kde developers doesn't test their code sometimes, so we should [22:11:56] you have already discussed about kdeprefix i think, haven't you? [22:12:15] Ronis_BR: that was decided long ago, not matter of this meeting [22:12:15] Ronis_BR: yes, it's dead (for now) [22:12:24] ok [22:12:30] too bad, but ok :) [22:12:40] Ronis_BR: we accept patches [22:12:40] :D [22:12:54] Ronis_BR: that was decided at the June meeting :) [22:13:12] ok i would like to dismiss the meeting for this moth [22:13:14] any objections? [22:13:25] ABCD: sorry, it is the first time that I hear about gentoo meetings :) [22:13:39] scarabeus: Before we go, when should we have the next meeting? [22:13:41] Ronis_BR: kde.gentoo.org its on the page, logs+summary [22:13:53] I suppose we don't need more meeting recently - just people eager to work on issues :P [22:13:54] 17.9. [22:13:57] jmbsvicetto: ^ [22:14:02] 3rd thursday in the month [22:14:09] 19:00 utc [22:14:15] if noone found it really evil or bad [22:14:17] right [22:14:33] Oh!!! [22:14:38] scarabeus: i will be on holiday that week [22:14:39] scarabeus: actually we could just meet in two weeks to evaluate work done [22:14:40] One last item I forgot to add to the meeting [22:14:50] Anyone willing to help solar about the 10.0 release? [22:15:00] I'll have to check my class schedule for Fall semester again, but I think that will work (it does fall in the middle of the day here, though) [22:15:10] jmbsvicetto: what kind of help [22:15:15] I want to help with KDE (and if I can compiz), but it would be great if more people could help [22:15:18] -*- scarabeus busy with x11stabling/overlays rework [22:15:54] yngwin: solar and a few others are working on catalyst specs to build a live-dvd with x86/amd64 to celebrate Gentoo's 10th birthday [22:16:08] catalyst.... [22:16:22] well thats release team work [22:16:23] jmbsvicetto: can they add ~ packages? [22:16:35] yngwin: there is no such team iirc [22:16:36] :D [22:16:37] they could add kde 4.3 :) [22:17:11] -*- yngwin sends thunderbolts scarabeus' way [22:17:13] because if kde3 will be there, we can simply grab sabayon, it will be more promotial [22:17:23] and polished :P [22:18:15] scarabeus: There's an release team [22:18:26] But this is a "special edition" [22:18:39] scarabeus: The point is to have KDE4, not 3.5.10 [22:18:40] solar or agaffney? [22:19:33] <-- Francois (n=francois@193.253.141.72) has quit (Client Quit) [22:20:27] ...? [22:20:36] release tem [22:21:30] http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/releng/ [22:22:24] ok guys anyway i have to run [22:22:31] here is the summary: http://dev.gentoo.org/~scarabeus/0908summary.txt [22:22:33] do logs yourself [22:22:36] jmbsvicetto: ^^ [22:22:39] download it NOW [22:22:44] :D [22:23:08] scarabeus: ok [22:23:12] <-- tbeadle (n=quassel@division.aa.arbor.net) has left #gentoo-meetings ("http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.") [22:23:34] * scarabeus has changed topic for #gentoo-meetings to: "Rem tene, verba sequentur || Keep to the subject and the words will follow" [22:23:50] scarabeus: can't find the file in packer [22:23:54] pecker* [22:24:29] jmbsvicetto: it downloads, its in public_html probably :D [22:24:48] jmbsvicetto: i have logs, do you need them? [22:24:51] -*- yngwin out [22:25:14] scarabeus: please ignore me [22:25:32] wired: I can't connect through http at the moment, but thanks [22:25:55] wired: I got it from Tomas. I was just showing signs of my "split brains" :\ [22:26:03] heheheh [22:26:09] no problem [22:26:20] did you log the meeting or you want me to give you my log? [22:26:57] <-- ABCD (n=ABCD@gentoo/contributor/abcd) has left #gentoo-meetings ("http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.") [22:27:50] jmbsvicetto: ^^ [22:29:25] wired: I didn't log [22:29:36] wired: Thanks for reminding me I forgot to add a rule to my irssi about this [22:31:37] <-- ayoy (n=ayoy@cs78245237.pp.htv.fi) has left #gentoo-meetings ("kbai") [22:32:27] jmbsvicetto: yw [22:32:42] jmbsvicetto: so where do you want log? pecker? [22:35:05] jmbsvicetto: ~wired/kde/200908_meeting.log [22:36:24] wired: thanks [22:40:10] :) [22:41:49] scarabeus: I have another request for you - starting Saturday, poke me for the logs/summary ;) [23:10:08] \part [23:10:16] <-- Gentoochild (n=bla@vpn5.rz.tu-ilmenau.de) has left #gentoo-meetings ("Konversation terminated!") [23:17:09] btw you can leave now, next on the list is gnome meeting, and i dont think you want to slack around that ;D [23:27:43] gnome meeting? nice